Official SEOW

Hi guys,

I'm in the process of creating High Res maps for Smolensk/Moscow and Lvov. I've worked out how to do it previously and it works pretty well. The main problem I'm faced with for the Moscow map is thet the grid in IL2 deforms quite badly to the left side of the screen in IL2. I'm zoomed in just to the point you see the actual map and not the more abstracted view, to 1km hexes. It really screws up the map making it very ugly.

I'm using a 26" LCD monitor and IL2 is configured in window mode 800x600.

The question is, does anyone have a solution on how to get rid of the deformation of the grid? I really want the grid in as it allows you to better judge distances for engagement and other purposes.

Thanks!
S!
Petr

Hi Petr,

The deformation is due to the landscape topography and the angle of view. The land is very bumpy near Vyazma etc. So, the effect is real! But it does make it hard to get an appealing screenshot.

Make sure you get in touch with Hawk5, he is working on similar maps at the moment.

Cheers,
4S

Hmmm, that was not what I was hoping for
But, are you sure? The deformation happens alwasy on the right of the IL2 screen. When you scroll a bit to the right, the deformation stays on the right, and the landscape previously deformed, becomes straight.
you could work around it by taking more captures but that makes it much more time consuming...

@ Hawk5,

Just did the complete Smolensk map. Will share once I've lined everything up 100%.

Cheers,
Petr

Hi Petr,
I've done a bigger full map of Lvov plus a city map of Hiyrov while fixing the Highways table. Please let me know where your up to so we can combine our work. Hope we haven't overlapped any work. Happy to send you what I've got.

On the topography the only spot that there isn't distortion is rivers and water. They are the best points for accurate grid references as they are at zero altitude. As soon as there is elevation there is some form of distortion and can't be avoided. I still use a 4:3 CRT and I find the distortion is focused on centre screen for me. If there is a very hilly area just grab more shots closer together and blend the overlapping sections together to get the best look that minimises distortion as much as possible.

Cheers,
Hawk 5

Hi Hawk5,

Great stuff and just in time as I'm planning to use the Lvov map soon.

After thinking about this some more, maybe the distortion isn't such a bad thing after all. At least now, you will know where the elevations are. It doesn't look pretty but actually serves a purpose. Hmmmm...

Cheers,
Petr

Hello Petr

Last month we began a new internal campaign on Smolensk map, I captured new sectors views, I hope we did not made the same work

I cannot give you access to my campaign (military secret ) but I uploaded files in Global Lounge MP with default logins and passwords:
http://85.14.216.230/SEOW/MP4/Scripts/default.php

--> One detail: In my Smolensk campaign, I added a road crossing Mstislavl (doesn't appear in Global Lounge MP) because there were no possibility for ground units coming from South-East to North.(Movement model = Normal) I captured again all roads and bridges. If you need new tables, I'll give you a link.

--> About your remark: I always had the same problem at the edges of maps. I use screenshots with referring only to the grid, it gives good results. I use a 2560x1600 resolution monitor and then reduce the size of the sreenshot.

JP,
another great map job!
Is there some special reason for a different background color on the east of the http://85.14.216.230/SEOW/MP4/Smolensk/Smolensk-DX.php ?

Salut Diego!

Yes there is a reason
I kept the existing large views of 4 Smolensk sectors (A,B,C,D). I don't know why it was in 2 colors...
All the others graphics are new.

A bientôt il mio amico!

The 2 colour issue was started by Paddington!

Nice work you guys.

That there were 2 different colors can be two explanation.

1. If there is two different greens. There has been two different setups what i have used to capture that images from that map. Like you have seen i don't like to capture grid lines. they have curves and it just don't fit my yea. so i use early morning or evening times to capture. That how shadows come in map and it reveals altitude differences. And compile images to larger one u use rivers and shores.

2. If there is big blue area. That map never should make to distribution for all. That was one campaigns area where was no action...

was thinking that how hard it would be to code grid lines for maps. Like roads are in code. That how they can be there or not. And they are always in straight lines...

The trick to getting straight grid lines (and I prefer to have grid lines present) is to capture all your shots with major N/S and E/W gridlines crossing exactly at the center of your screen... then trim off the most distorted edges leaving perhaps a 5x5 square... then fit them on a pre-mapped grid. Finding the exact center of your screen isn't difficult (I use a dot on a bit of plastic wrap stuck to my screen, centering in by zooming in and out on a reference point), and you can script the trimming steps in Gimp, speeding up the process considerably. You can also script the grid generation once you have a good measure of the pixels to meters number. I had written a series of posts at the 69.GIAP forum about this, but alas, they seem to have disappeared and I don't have copies, so I'll have to recreate them some time.

The grid lines that you centered on will be undistorted. The worst distortions will be in the corners. If any corners are unacceptable, you can patch them by capturing a diamond (actually a full-sized square, but tilted on one apex) centered on the grid crossing that defines that corner and with an apex half-way along one side of each of the sides of the four images that created the distorted corner. This, of course, is possible only if you are trimming enough off the tops and sides of each of your screen shots to allow enough room to tilt that image 45 degrees and still fit into your screen capture area. Because the diamond is centered on a grid crossing, that area is undistorted, and any remaining distortions will be centered on the apexes of the new diamond... and they will be minimal.

When put together, this results in an image with grid lines (now particularly useful because distances are important for new functions) and minimal distortions... and because you constructed this over a known grid, fitting it into the mission planner is greatly simplified.

Nice tips Tushka. Problem with some maps seems to be that the Grid doesn't stay "fixed" on the map which is important for when you recenter your image as then the grid won't match the ones you did before.

I'm leaning towards capture without the grid and then imposing the grid through photoshop but I haven't tried. I actually know little about photoshop but Saos thinks it should work.

S!
Petr

The grid is by definition fixed... as all locations are determined in relation to the grid. The distortions you see are not distortions in the grid, but in your view of it caused by displaying the grid as a projection on local topography when not viewed from directly overhead... and that is not a bug but a feature, because it preserves the proper relationship between the defining grid and surface features.

In creating a map, we attempt to display each area from directly overhead. This, of course is not possible on a 3-D map that isn't flat, so we approximate it.