Plane substitutions

Petr · Post by **Petr** » Tue Jul 30, 2013 2:08 pm

Hi all,

The following plane substitutions have been proposed.
Please validate and provide feedback.
As discussed, we are looking for the same speed, armament, range and defensive capabilities (not necessarily in that order).

1. Vickers Wellington Mk1 => IL4 (Fab1000 are removed).
2. Bristol Beaufort => A-20-DB7 (only torpedo available)
3. Martin Maryland Recon => Belnheim Mk1
4. Short Sunderland => H8K1
5. Fiat BR-20 => DB-3M

Validated during meeting on 04/08 as above.

Cheers,
Petr

Classic EAF19 · Post by **Classic EAF19** » Tue Jul 30, 2013 2:46 pm

I would suggest that the DB3-M and IL4 are visually far too familiar to each other for them both to be used (they are essentially the same airframe)

Based on what we have available in game I believe the best type to act as a substitute to the Br.20 is in fact the Ki-21-II this aircraft is almost dimensionally identical, has similiar defensive armament and range but lower bomb load however a higher speed. I believe the Ki-21-II to be the best match.

Petr · Post by **Petr** » Tue Jul 30, 2013 3:09 pm

Classic EAF19 wrote:I would suggest that the DB3-M and IL4 are visually far too familiar to each other for them both to be used (they are essentially the same airframe)

Based on what we have available in game I believe the best type to act as a substitute to the Br.20 is in fact the Ki-21-II this aircraft is almost dimensionally identical, has similiar defensive armament and range but lower bomb load however a higher speed. I believe the Ki-21-II to be the best match.

Hey Classic,
I'm not sure. The nose is certainly very different and looks more like a BR-20 IMO.
Also, according to IL2 compare, the DB3-M is faster then the Ki-24-II

Good skins (enforced) will also provide a good distinction between the planes.

Not sure, but currently I seem to be more in favor of the DB3-M.

Cheers,
petr

Classic EAF19 · Post by **Classic EAF19** » Tue Jul 30, 2013 4:04 pm

Admittedly yes the nose is very different but the rest of the airframe is almost identical. That being said how often do fighter pilots see the front end of a bomber

Although skins will be a great factor if anyone else is like me I tend to shoot at an aircraft silhouette not what colours its wearing, I guess we'll have to see if the bomber fires back or identify its colours

22GCT_Hollywood · Post by **22GCT_Hollywood** » Wed Jul 31, 2013 1:45 am

In fact the planes are very very similar, the nose is the main discriminating, but it is also true that the level of performance DB-3M is very close to caretteristiche of Br-20.
At present then, if in the preparation phase of the campaign prepare two skins also completely different from the real ones actually used in Africa, are more inclined to the solution with Il4 and Br-20.

Ala13_Florete · Post by **Ala13_Florete** » Wed Jul 31, 2013 6:21 am

Both aircraft seem right to me. One question, have you considered the possibility of using the "Do-17". Externally is quite similar to "BR-20".

[EDIT]

The "Dornier" is faster than the other models that we have suggested. Either are valid for us, but we prefer the DB-3M. The tendency to burn the "Ki-21-II" makes this bomber not very useful.

Nus Vemus!

Petr · Post by **Petr** » Thu Aug 01, 2013 3:43 am

First post updated. Thanks Hollywood & Florente for your feedback!

@ Classic, do you feel comfortable to decide for your group or do you want to validate with 102nd & IAF first?

IAF.ViFF · Post by **IAF.ViFF** » Thu Aug 01, 2013 6:20 am

Classic EAF19 wrote:I would suggest that the DB3-M and IL4 are visually far too familiar to each other for them both to be used (they are essentially the same airframe)

Based on what we have available in game I believe the best type to act as a substitute to the Br.20 is in fact the Ki-21-II this aircraft is almost dimensionally identical, has similiar defensive armament and range but lower bomb load however a higher speed. I believe the Ki-21-II to be the best match.

As per Classic.

S!

150GCT_Italo · Post by **150GCT_Italo** » Sat Aug 10, 2013 7:10 am

I found this on the net. I don't know if they are completely compatible but a test could be useful.

http://www.diavolirossi.net/forums/show ... -Fiat-Br20

http://www.sas1946.com/main/index.php/t ... 784.0.html

I tested the firs and is compatible with the 4.12 HFSX but is quite poor.

The second one is much better and quite accurate, but unfortunately is for HFSX 4.10

I tried some workaround to make it compatible to 4.12 but whit no results. If someone would be able to correct it and fix it (Maraz?) should be wonderful to have this airplane in this HFSX campaign!

Petr · Post by **Petr** » Mon Aug 19, 2013 3:43 am

@ Italo,
Good news!
The Br-20 will be included in HSFX7.
I've reworked the numbers and will update soon.

150GCT_Italo · Post by **150GCT_Italo** » Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:57 am

Petr wrote:@ Italo,
Good news!
The Br-20 will be included in HSFX7.
I've reworked the numbers and will update soon.

Very happy to read this!
Thanx!

I will be happy to make its new proper skin.

PS If you don't mind (and only if you really have the time!) i should be happy to have an anticipation (a working mod) of the Aircraft installable in the current 4.11.1 for the HFSX 6.0.17, so i can work on it in the meantime to obtain one/two skins in time before SEOW start.

150GCT_Italo · Post by **150GCT_Italo** » Mon Sep 09, 2013 6:24 pm

In the very last release of the MTO MOD pack v. 1.6 i haven't noticed the promised BR.20.
I missed something?

CC_Tofolo · Post by **CC_Tofolo** » Tue Sep 10, 2013 12:04 am

Hi Italo,
No Br-20 was promised on this pack. If you tried adding it as a new plane, you'd find that although you can fly it, there's no way tu run the bomb sight. So at this moment we're sticking to the DB-3M until:
a) we find a solution for the bombardier position and bombsight, test the plane and agree that it works fine on HSFX6
b) we move to 4.12 + HSFX 7

The same happens for Beaufort and Wellington (well, in the Br-20 you cannot jump to gunner positions)

150GCT_Italo · Post by **150GCT_Italo** » Tue Sep 10, 2013 5:17 am

CC_Tofolo wrote:Hi Italo,
No Br-20 was promised on this pack. If you tried adding it as a new plane, you'd find that although you can fly it, there's no way tu run the bomb sight. So at this moment we're sticking to the DB-3M until:
a) we find a solution for the bombardier position and bombsight, test the plane and agree that it works fine on HSFX6
b) we move to 4.12 + HSFX 7

The same happens for Beaufort and Wellington (well, in the Br-20 you cannot jump to gunner positions)

Ok. Thank you.

150GCT_Italo · Post by **150GCT_Italo** » Sat Oct 26, 2013 6:53 pm

Ok. This is my skin for the Fiat BR.20. Is the best i can do with this poor model and this bad mapping but is better than nothing.

The pack contain 3 skin for a generic pourpose in the SEOW MED (Sicily and North Africa environment).

Enjoy.

Download here > https://mega.co.nz/#!acM2TJ6Q

Decrypt key for download: erftxBfRPhoEwYvpP7DkDQS69whx_1HELGCZg2OGdP8